Weeks 4-6
Please use the comments section to answer questions. Do not try to answer all questions. Try to keep up an average of one per week, with time for a few comments on the ideas of others.
2. The Wife of Bath's Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
3.Hahn's essay (see critical reader)on The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelleidentifies the motif of the loathly lady, but arguesit has a different purpose than asserting the feminine. What does he think the function of the story is?
4. In the context of Elizabethan and Jacobean sonnets, how can we define "conceits"?
5. Discuss what you think is the most striking or outrageous example.
6. What does Revard (1997) suggest about the relationship between language, sex, power and transgression in the English Renaissance?
The Wife of Bath’s Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
ReplyDeleteI think the discussion between whether Chaucer wrote The Wife of Bath’s Tale with purposely-feminist elements is extremely interesting. And is something that I have changed my mind on many times. As we well know there is a lot of speculation about it throughout many critics.
I want to believe that Chaucer was well ahead of his time, whether he knew it or not. With his feminist elements being arguably clear throughout the written text. However I have come to the conclusion that this was not the case.
Susan Carter is an author of “The Chaucer Review” one her arguments in support of Chaucer as a feminist is based around the motif of ‘The Loathly Lady’. She believes that although this is a woman who appears to be relying on men she is manipulating the situation to be in her power. When looking at it this way I think it is important to look at the dictionary defining of a feminist, being “A person who supports feminism.” According to the Cambridge dictionary feminism can be defined as “the belief that women should be allowed the same rights, power, and opportunities as men and be treated in the same way, or the set of activities intended to achieve this state.” If indeed ‘The Loathly Lady’ is using her gender to manipulate her role to be above the male this is not feminism. Therefore I think it is fair to say that in this instance Carter is in fact wrong and perhaps too optimistic about this theory.
An interesting example to look at is when the Queen is given power in the Royal Court. “And gave him to the Queen, all at her will to choose whether she would him save or put to death.” We can argue that the fact alone that the power is in the hands of a (female) Queen (not a King) being a key element of feminism. However it is important not to forget who administered the power to her in the first place. “And gave him to the Queen” Him being the king!! Without the male choosing to give her power she wouldn’t be where she is. Therefore she is still governed by male, although its not big and obvious.
I think Chaucer has used The Wife of Bath’s Tale to make a mockery of women’s beliefs that they are entitled to the same rights as men. Again I think it would be optimistic to assume that in those times a male writer would be aware of feminism let alone openly using it as a key theme in his writing. Hansen (1992) proposes that the wife is in fact a victim of antifeminism, and is so desperate to go against male stereotypes but in actual facts ends up looking like a fool and with less power than when she started.
I would be really interested to know what you all thought?
References:
DeleteCarter, S. (2003). Coupling The Beastly Bride and The Hunter Hunted: What Lies Behind in Chaucer's Wife of Bath's Tale. In The Chaucer Review, Vol. 37, No. 4 2003.
Hansen, E. T. (1992). Chaucer and the Fiction of Gender. Univerisity of California Press.
Well argued and well thought out. I guess a fall-back position for those who argue against your position is that even by raising these issues, albeit to mock them, he is giving some recognition to the role of women in society, and some voice to those views.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteQ. Hahn's essay on The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle identifies the motif of the loathly lady, but argues it has a different purpose than asserting the feminine. What does he think the function of the story is?
ReplyDeleteA. Hahn, T. (1995) identifies that the motif of the loathly lady, does in fact, serve a different purpose than asserting the feminine, as he mentions in the last few lines of the third paragraph that her absence of beauty and manners which branded her as "a hag" before, was what later accredits her as a lady. Hahn, T. (1995) states in the introduction that The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle is a common story - the classical story of the loathly lady finding the right guy and being freed from the bewitchment, turning back into a beautiful, fulfilled woman - which Hahn calls the double role of the loathly lady - "playing both the beauty and the beast". Although, looking at Hahn's introduction to the poem, it seems that he is suggesting that the intended plot counts on Ragnelle to be a stereotypical damsel in distress who waits for her prince charming to save her from her awful curse, he instead argues from a different perspective, that the story actually depends on Ragnelle, who "holds the poem together" and in a way she solves problems at hand without having to be beautiful or well-mannered. Hahn, T. (1995) refers to Ragnelle as the "nexus" that ties the male characters together and makes the "fraternal and hierarchic bongs of chivalric solidarity", possible. I think that Hahn interprets the function of the story to be the fact that when women are given the right to have their own choices, they can come to hold more power than men, and the motif of the loathly lady and the transformation of Ragnelle back to a beautiful woman, when Sir Gawain gives her the right of choice, is used as a tool to help the audience to understand this concept.
Reference:
DeleteHahn, T. (Ed.). (1995.) The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelle. In Sir Gawain: Eleven Romances and Tales. Kalamazoo, Michigan: Medieval Institute Publications
The Wife of Bath's Tale is considered by some critics to indicate that Chaucer may have been a feminist. Why might they believe this? Do you agree? Remember to cite evidence from the text or some other source.
ReplyDeleteFor a long time, the ‘Wife of Bath’s Tale’ has risen questions about whether or not Chaucer may have been a feminist. I thoroughly believe that this is true and there are many examples that support this claim scattered throughout the aformentioned text.
While reading this piece, it is evident that women are portrayed in a positive light throughout. Early in the tale, a young maiden is taken by a knight and forced to have sexual intercourse against her own will. Forunately for the woman, the knight is brought before King Arthur to face death as punishment for his crime. However, the Queen pleads to King Arthur and asks to have the knight brought before her and her court of women. This portrays the power that women may have yielded in this time, where a King gives an opportunity to women pass judgement in legal preceedings. Additionally, the Queen’s actions exemplifies the willingness to advocate mercy in situations such as these especially when a man, the King no less, had just deemed this man to death. Again, this supports the notion that Chaucer may have been a feminist as he places the Queen in a very prominent position in the tale.
In almost every aspect of this story, there is a woman whom is directly affecting the likely outcome and moral of the piece. In the early portion it is the Queen, throughout the middle it is local women that the knight must ask questions and then in the end it the old woman that becomes his wife. It goes against all traditional stereotypes that places women under men in terms of power and even knowledge. The old woman is very knowledgable as she provides the answer to the knight and also portrays hints of manipulation in that she makes the man agree to certain terms before offering the answer. This leads to the knight being made to marry the old woman, declaring her to be the true “winner” and the young man being her “prize”.
For the most part, I believe Chaucer used the ‘Wife of Barth’s Tale’ to portray that he was an avid feminist through the examples stated here. Furthermore, I believe it would be extremely cynical to view this as an antifeminist piece as Chaucer in the end ecourages and raises the status of women thoughout the tale. The simple fact that women are centre of interest further re-enforces this notion.